I watched the video and read the article on mr. Cole's site. I'm afraid that I'm less optimistic than mr. Cole. I agree with his assesment that this was more a revolution and less a civil war. It's painting it in fluffy pink that's grating.
More to the subject of your post, the idea that "people in the region were very happy to see somebody rescue the revolutionaries" doesn't sound right. I would say that people in the region were very happy to see somebody helping to overthrow the regime. Based on recent experiences (Tunisia, Egypt) it seems that people in the region don't know what to do with their revolutions once the regime is down. We can only hope that Lybia will show the way, but I wouldn't hold my breath.
"it seems that people in the region don't know what to do with their revolutions once the regime is down."
But, at least they have the opportunity to change their system of government Pisa. It's a shame they had to face tanks in order to get that opportunity. Whatever Libya comes up with to replace Qaddafi, it can't be any worse.
You're right, Maury. I was only challenging Cole's somewhat glamorous view of the revolution. In his article he even mentions "working classes", conveniently overlooking the socialist character of Lybia's former (at last!) regime.
My point is that the goal of the revolution was to overthrow Qaddafi, period. Not a leftist revolution as per Cole's wishful thinking, although he doesn't say it explicitely.
The best outcome of the Arab Spring, in my opinion, is that now people know they can do it.
I'll tell you something else Pisa. It's starting to seem the "Arab Street" isn't nearly as anti-American as these regimes painted it over the last 40 years. The American flag flies right below the Libyan one in Bengazi. According to a Libyan from my area who was on the local news last night, and who returned to Libya to fight the regime, Libyans love the US, and he expects the American flag to fly in Tripoli too.
Notice there has yet to be a US flag burning demonstration in the new Tunisia and Egypt either. And while Syrian Asswad loyalists ransacked the US Embassy in Damascus, that's definitely not the feeling on the Syrian streets. Maybe all those US demands for more rights for Arabs over the years bought us some goodwill after all.
Maybe all those US demands for more rights for Arabs over the years bought us some goodwill after all
I don't think this is about US demands for more rights, but about its willingness to throw its full weight to back those demands (even at the speed of a limping snail, but still...). The arab street is begining to understand that americans are actually not only listening to what simple people have to say, but also striving to help fulfill their demands. This is a tremendous change compared to the chronic arrogance of their own leaders. US embodies everything arab regimes are not.
On the afternoon of Saturday July 23rd, there were two rallies in Lafayette Park across from the White House. Both rallies were against the ongoing mass murdering rule of two dictators named Bashir: Bashir Assad of Syria; and Omar Bashir of Sudan, indicted for genocide and other war crimes committed in Darfur by the International Criminal Court. Both rallies were attended mainly by their respective immigrant groups, Syrian-Americans and Sudanese-Americans, both called for their dictator's overthrow and both rallies had plenty of American flags that they waved enthusiasticly. The Syrian-Americans began their rally by playing the Star Spangled Banner!
Syrian Americans sang the Star Spangled Banner? Really?
The Syrian president's name is actually not the same as the Sudanese president. But the only difference is one letter: Bashar al Assad is soon to be the ex president of Syria and Bashir was the Sudanese president.
Incidentally: "Sudanese President Umar al-Bashir announced today a unilateral cease-fire in Southern Kordofan and banned any foreign organization from entering the oil-producing state, Sudan’s state TV reported.
Forces loyal to the government in Khartoum have clashed since June 5 with insurgents from the northern sector of South Sudan’s ruling party.
The United Nations Office of the High Commissioner for Human Rights called in an Aug. 15 report for an investigation into possible crimes against humanity and war crimes in the state, allegedly committed mainly by government forces."
8 comments :
I watched the video and read the article on mr. Cole's site. I'm afraid that I'm less optimistic than mr. Cole. I agree with his assesment that this was more a revolution and less a civil war. It's painting it in fluffy pink that's grating.
More to the subject of your post, the idea that "people in the region were very happy to see somebody rescue the revolutionaries" doesn't sound right. I would say that people in the region were very happy to see somebody helping to overthrow the regime. Based on recent experiences (Tunisia, Egypt) it seems that people in the region don't know what to do with their revolutions once the regime is down. We can only hope that Lybia will show the way, but I wouldn't hold my breath.
"it seems that people in the region don't know what to do with their revolutions once the regime is down."
But, at least they have the opportunity to change their system of government Pisa. It's a shame they had to face tanks in order to get that opportunity. Whatever Libya comes up with to replace Qaddafi, it can't be any worse.
You're right, Maury. I was only challenging Cole's somewhat glamorous view of the revolution. In his article he even mentions "working classes", conveniently overlooking the socialist character of Lybia's former (at last!) regime.
My point is that the goal of the revolution was to overthrow Qaddafi, period. Not a leftist revolution as per Cole's wishful thinking, although he doesn't say it explicitely.
The best outcome of the Arab Spring, in my opinion, is that now people know they can do it.
I'll tell you something else Pisa. It's starting to seem the "Arab Street" isn't nearly as anti-American as these regimes painted it over the last 40 years. The American flag flies right below the Libyan one in Bengazi. According to a Libyan from my area who was on the local news last night, and who returned to Libya to fight the regime, Libyans love the US, and he expects the American flag to fly in Tripoli too.
Notice there has yet to be a US flag burning demonstration in the new Tunisia and Egypt either. And while Syrian Asswad loyalists ransacked the US Embassy in Damascus, that's definitely not the feeling on the Syrian streets. Maybe all those US demands for more rights for Arabs over the years bought us some goodwill after all.
Maybe all those US demands for more rights for Arabs over the years bought us some goodwill after all
I don't think this is about US demands for more rights, but about its willingness to throw its full weight to back those demands (even at the speed of a limping snail, but still...). The arab street is begining to understand that americans are actually not only listening to what simple people have to say, but also striving to help fulfill their demands. This is a tremendous change compared to the chronic arrogance of their own leaders. US embodies everything arab regimes are not.
On the afternoon of Saturday July 23rd, there were two rallies in Lafayette Park across from the White House. Both rallies were against the ongoing mass murdering rule of two dictators named Bashir: Bashir Assad of Syria; and Omar Bashir of Sudan, indicted for genocide and other war crimes committed in Darfur by the International Criminal Court. Both rallies were attended mainly by their respective immigrant groups, Syrian-Americans and Sudanese-Americans, both called for their dictator's overthrow and both rallies had plenty of American flags that they waved enthusiasticly. The Syrian-Americans began their rally by playing the Star Spangled Banner!
Syrian Americans sang the Star Spangled Banner? Really?
The Syrian president's name is actually not the same as the Sudanese president. But the only difference is one letter: Bashar al Assad is soon to be the ex president of Syria and Bashir was the Sudanese president.
Incidentally: "Sudanese President Umar al-Bashir announced today a unilateral cease-fire in Southern Kordofan and banned any foreign organization from entering the oil-producing state, Sudan’s state TV reported.
Forces loyal to the government in Khartoum have clashed since June 5 with insurgents from the northern sector of South Sudan’s ruling party.
The United Nations Office of the High Commissioner for Human Rights called in an Aug. 15 report for an investigation into possible crimes against humanity and war crimes in the state, allegedly committed mainly by government forces."
is the president of north Sudan, I mean.
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